Data Driven Decision Making

In 3 Questions Every Business Owner Must Ask & How to Make Data-Driven Decisions, Amos Schwartzfarb & Trevor Boehm, Co-Authors of Levers: The Framework for Building Repeatability in Your Business, joins host William Glass to discuss scaling your startup. You’ll learn:

• The W3, which are the three questions every business owner must ask themselves about their customers
• How to move from metric aware to metric driven in your decision making
• Why you should be focusing on repeatability and NOT scalability in your business

This episode is jam-packed with value and will have you understanding how to make data-driven decisions to grow your business.

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About Amos Schwartzfarb & Trevor Boehm:

Amos Schwartzfarb is the Managing Director of Techstars Austin and author of the best-selling books for startup sales, Sell More Faster – The Ultimate Sales Playbook for Startups and LEVERS – The Framework For Building Repeatability Into Your Business.  Amos began his career as an entrepreneur in the mid 90’s in the Bay Area at Shoreline Mountain Products and HotJobs.com. In 2004 after moving to Los Angeles, Amos founded Work.com which was eventually merged with Business.com where he was VP of Sales. Business.com sold in 2008 and in 2009 Amos moved to Austin and founded mySpoonful with Stacy Horne. mySpoonful was sold in 2012 and Amos joined Blacklocus shortly after. A year later Blacklocus was sold to Homedepot. In his spare time, Amos loves to hang out with his family, mountain bike and play in the mountains.

Trevor Boehm was a writer before finding his way into building companies. A serial founder, he has also invested in more than forty startups, many of those through Techstars’ first Impact accelerator and as Managing Director of Alexa Next Stage, a program run with the Amazon Alexa Fund. He is currently at the venture fund Saturn Five.

Learn more about Levers: The Framework for Building Repeatability in Your Business.

Transcription

This transcription is autogenerated and may contain errors.

William Glass: [00:00:00] Are you interested in making data driven decisions that will enable your business to scale and be successful? If so then you’ve come to the right place. I’m William Glass, CEO and co-founder of ostrich. And of course you were a host of Silicon alley podcast. Today. I sit down with Amos Schwartzfarb as well as Trevor Boehm, the coauthors of levers.

[00:00:22] And this book is all about how to identify the key metrics and key analytics within your business that will ultimately. To scaling success. You’ve got to figure out what those repeatable processes are and they dive deep into why this is so important and how you can actually implement this in your business edition.

[00:00:38] They talk about the W3C, which are the three questions you need to ask in order to truly understand who your customer is and what it is that they understand and love about your product or service together. They have a plethora of experience in the startup world, both within Techstars, as well as their own ventures and entrepreneurial.

[00:00:58] And also in venture [00:01:00] capital. So we dive deep into some of their experiences just in general, within venture and at the end, talk about their best investments and, uh, some of the ones that didn’t pan out. So well, if you haven’t already go ahead and pound that subscribe button. So you notify windows air every Friday without further ado.

[00:01:14] I hope you enjoy today’s entrepreneur focused episode of Silicon valley podcasts. Trevor bell and AEMO’s Schwartz far up. Are you interested in growing and scaling your business? Welcome to the Silicon alley podcast where you’ll hear from entrepreneurs, venture, capitalists, and top performers on what it truly takes to grow and scale a business.

[00:01:35] You’ll walk away with actionable insights. You can apply in your own business and life now to William Glass, the CEO and co-founder of ostrich and your host of the Silicon alley podcast. Amos, Trevor, welcome to Silicon alley podcast. Super excited to have you guys on today. 

[00:01:51] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:01:51] Cool. Thank you. So, yeah. 

[00:01:54] William Glass: [00:01:54] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:01:54] I’m excited. Dive into all things entrepreneurship. You guys have written a really awesome book called [00:02:00] levers, and we’ll definitely want to get into that. But one of the things before we hit record is we were kind of chopping it up and you guys have a really good rapport and dynamic between each other.

[00:02:08] I’m curious, how did you guys meet and come together and decide to write this book? 

[00:02:14] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:02:14] Uh, I’ll take the first part of that Trevor. You can take the second. Yeah. Um, we, we met, I kind of a long time ago, Trevor worked with another. Friend of ours at, um, at, uh, uh, impact accelerator called, uh, gosh, unlimited. Um, and there was a point, uh, several, a few years back where unlimited actually became part of Techstars and, um, and Zoe Schlag, who is the other person that we know in common and Trevor became part of the Techstars.

[00:02:50] Uh, family for a little while. And so Trevor and I, we knew each other prior, we worked really intimately together in Austin, uh, as we were running [00:03:00] a couple of different programs in Techstars. And, um, and so we just got to know each other really well, you know, investing together, uh, alongside each other building companies together.

[00:03:11] Um, so really kind of hands-on um, and then I’ll, I’ll let you Trevor to the second part. How did we, how did we come up with the idea for write a book? 

[00:03:20] Trevor Boehm: [00:03:20] Sure. Yeah, I can do the, I can do the book story. Uh, so the, the short version of how we came up with the idea to write the book was, uh, we’d been working together.

[00:03:32] Both on the investing side and on the support side, right. It, it once, okay, now that we’ve got these companies, how do we make sure that they don’t fall off the rails as they’re, uh, as they’re headed into whatever direction they’re going. And then we started to take what were pieces of, uh, of our own experiences that we’d been working using within our companies for years and years.

[00:03:53] Um, and. And as we were, uh, taking those pieces and [00:04:00] using them in the, in the investing and support and coaching that we were doing, um, it just all started to click together. And it just, I think, I think kind of mutually became to this point where it seemed like, well, it was really, um, not only this is valuable, we knew this was valuable to us.

[00:04:15] We understood the power of a metrics driven business and the perspective that we took and how to, how to get there. But it’s really resonating with the companies that we’re working with. And so I think it was Amos pulled me out, uh, late one night, uh, when we’re working with a bunch of founders and sort of took me into the corner of a room and said, Hey, what did we wrote a book on this?

[00:04:36] Can I sorry? Uh, wait a second. Uh, let’s let’s think about this a little bit, because books are just, uh, you know, such a massive project. Um, but it, it just kept, uh, it kept pulling and we kept working on it. And then, and then here we are today. 

[00:04:52] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:04:52] Well, I think, and I just to add to that, one of the things, you know, that Trevor and I, when we were working, you know, when we work with these companies, there is [00:05:00] these two individuals that we would bring in a lot for part of the, this process, which we’ve been running this process for a long time.

[00:05:06] We just named it in the book. Um, we would bring these two particular people all the time, uh, for their areas of expertise, which is around. Um, prioritization product prioritization and financial modeling, um, financial modeling, meaning building your, your forward looking plan, not your reporting backwards.

[00:05:22] And so, you know, when, when Trevor and I finally said, okay, let’s, let’s, you know, let’s see if we can pull this off. You know, one of the first things we did was we turned to Trevor and Cody and said, Hey, will you guys participate in, in the writing of this book? And so when we look at it from the eye, it is a big undertaking.

[00:05:39] A book is a huge undertaking. If you haven’t written one. We had the fortune of having four people who have, are experts in their field, being able to write about their thing. And then, you know, for, you know, Trevor, you know, is he’s been a part of several books, books being written, which is why he knows how hard it is.

[00:05:57] You know, we had his brain to be able to sort of wrap and [00:06:00] say, okay, how do we make this something that’s actually cohesive that people will enjoy and get value out of and not just be, you know, something cobbled together. 

[00:06:08] Trevor Boehm: [00:06:08] Yeah, no. Oh, just a quick, quick note. Troy, Troy EMS, Cody, and I

[00:06:19] Yeah. 

[00:06:20] William Glass: [00:06:20] Perfect. So that’s awesome that you’re able to bring in people from different areas of expertise to really focus on those key aspects of the book. I want to actually use something in the book and use it on you guys. So you’ve got this thing called what? The three W’s or w three. So what, what is that?

[00:06:36] And can you use that to talk about who this book is for and why it’s different than all of the other business books? 

[00:06:43] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:06:43] Yeah, we, we, we can, um, and we, we actually talk about this a lot and we talked about it, even in writing the book, we do, we are very much drink our own Kool-Aid and, and we can go down a path to talks about how we do that as well.

[00:06:56] Um, so the, the w three, this is. Like, [00:07:00] so let me step back for a second. There is nothing in the book that has not been talked about in some way before, right? There’s no invention in the book. Well, we have done in the book has said, here are these concepts and we’ve created really simple to follow hard to do, but simple to follow frameworks for each piece of the, of it and, and put, put it together in a way that’s really understandable and, and approachable.

[00:07:21] So w three came out of, uh, the time when I was at a, at a company that I, I stepped into a sales role. Sales leadership role. And the company had been doing, you know, several million dollars in revenue for a long time, but not growing. And so I had the fortune of walking into a company that had customers, but didn’t know anything about their customers, which is why they couldn’t grow.

[00:07:42] And so I, I, it really was me asking three simple questions over and over until I felt satisfied with the answer. And when I was satisfied with the answer, we put the pedal down on it and it’s who is our customer? Who do you believe your customer is? And more importantly, what is the data? You have to prove that you’re right.

[00:07:58] What are they buying from [00:08:00] you? Not what are you selling to them, but what are they buying from you? Um, and then why does it matter to their business and to the individual buyer? And for all of those things, like what is the data that we have that says we’re right. And so when you can answer those three questions, any entrepreneur can try to answer those questions and have an answer, but when you can answer those questions and back it up with data, you know, that you’re set, you’re starting in the right path.

[00:08:23] You can put the pedal down. Um, and so. For, for levers, we are looking at business builders, meaning, you know, people who are actually trying to build something that, um, that they, they have a theory of who and what it is that they want to do. And they might be a little bit down that path, but what they haven’t found yet is repeatability in their business and their, and that’s what they’re looking to do.

[00:08:49] They’re looking to, how do I figure out the opera operational operationalize the repeatability in our business. And then we w I’ll just take it a step further [00:09:00] because we also teach levers Trevor and I teach levers as a, as a course for companies that are a little bit further along. And for those companies, we’re even more specific in our w three, which is the company should be generating revenue.

[00:09:14] They should have line of sight of nine to 12 months. Of, um, cash in the bank to run their business so that when we, and there’s a bunch of other things too, but so that when we work with them, they actually can focus on their business and not be stressed about making payroll or fundraising or whatever.

[00:09:29] And then some of the other things in that w three are, um, there needs to be CEO led business. There needs to be at least one other senior, your executive on the team. Um, I’m sure I’m missing a couple of other things too, but. It wasn’t a cute, 

[00:09:43] Trevor Boehm: [00:09:43] awesome. 

[00:09:43] William Glass: [00:09:43] Yeah, no, I appreciate you explaining that. And I think it’s, you know, as you said, it’s very easy to come up with an answer to those questions as an early stage startup founder, I can throw stuff at the wall, but having the metrics to necessarily justify the w three, I think is really important.

[00:09:59] So yeah. What are [00:10:00] some of the, the metrics or things that you track to be able to say, yes, this is actually our customer. And here’s why, like, what are some of those things that you can be thinking about? Entrepreneurs can be thinking about that they need to be tracking to answer those questions. 

[00:10:16] Trevor Boehm: [00:10:16] You just to make sure I understand your question.

[00:10:17] Are you speaking specifically to how we think about our metrics relative to the book or how, what, what entrepreneurs should be doing, uh, generally as they track metrics for their customer? Yeah, 

[00:10:28] William Glass: [00:10:28] I was thinking in generally, so applying it generally, but if you want to use levers as an example, feel free.

[00:10:34] Trevor Boehm: [00:10:34] Okay. Maybe we’ll jump in, but I just want to make sure I, I thought that’s what you’re saying, but I wanted to make sure. And then I, then I’ll back up just to Tony back actually, because  did a beautiful job articulating the first step you, but, but there’s also the other two, as we think about who, who, what this is to them.

[00:10:51] You know, who it matters to you and why, and quickly on those, the way we see that, uh, the what in terms of what it is that they’re actually buying [00:11:00] relative to the book relative to any work that we do with them is really controlled. Uh, the there’s, there’s a lot that happens in the world of, uh, of growing and building a business.

[00:11:12] And the vast majority of it, it feels like it’s completely outside of your control right now. You don’t understand what’s happening. You don’t understand how to repeat what you would, the success you’ve had in the past. So our hope is that we’re able to bring control back into the driver’s seat of the business builder through a metrics driven.

[00:11:28] That’s the, that’s the big vision. And then the why there, uh, the reason that matters to the, to the people who care about this aspect to the business builders, who you would be interested in reading the book is that they want to build the world that they see. Right. Like they care about building a vision of something that they’re usually sort of compelled really driven by some picture of the world that they want to create.

[00:11:52] And this allows them to do that, or it puts them in the driver’s seat. And in order to do that, it’s not, it’s not about fundraising, but it’s not about trying to [00:12:00] pitch some really great stories that you can get a bunch of money. Right. And it’s not about, uh, just trying to sort of. You know, kind of a hustle to get kind of whatever, whatever success you want kind of in the day to day, it’s really about like, how do I put myself in the driver’s seat and get to build whatever world, you know, is important to me.

[00:12:20] Okay. So that’s a w Surrey then to the metrics question. Yeah. So metrics are. Are I love talking about metrics or KPIs, key performance indicators. I think the vast majority, there’s a lot of good content on this. I think there’s a lot of really bad content and by bad, I mostly mean confusing. Uh, it’s it’s an area where like people get paid to make it sound complex and to make you take you to you don’t actually understand what’s happening right now.

[00:12:49] And so that for me, the big sort of power. Of identifying the metrics that matter in your business are giving you the ability to make decisions. Again, back to this idea of [00:13:00] control. Like, do these numbers help me make decisions in the business and do they help me focus on what matters most? And yeah. And to that, what matters most piece is the key for knowing whether or not you’ve gotten there for, if you have something that actually matters is that you have some kind of metric that’s geared towards a milestone that unlocks a new future, right.

[00:13:23] A new reality in your business. So, so again, to me, as I think about metrics, as you’re trying to figure out how to identify the numbers that matter in this stage of the business, It helps you make decisions. It takes you to some key milestones that you’re trying to get to. And that milestone unlocks something totally new.

[00:13:42] Like if you’re able to get to, you know, some type of conversion rate or some customer acquisition costs, then you’re able to spend a bunch of money on that channel because you know that it’s going to be profit. Right. And so then suddenly you change, you change, right? Your, your KPIs are actually relative, right.

[00:13:57] Those metrics shift now, because instead of [00:14:00] focusing on the customer acquisition costs and optimize NEC you can just focus on dialing that whole thing up. Right. And just expanding as much as he can in order to get customers activated and then keep them on, on your product or. 

[00:14:12] William Glass: [00:14:12] Gotcha. Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense.

[00:14:13] And yeah. Thinking, thinking of metrics in a way of allowing you to make decisions that give you greater control of the business. I like, I like that definition a lot because I think I know I’ve been guilty of it. You hear data driven decisions or, you know, all that kind of stuff, but there’s so much data out there now that you can collect, but is it actually.

[00:14:32] To the business. And I think that is a challenge that I know I faced and I’m sure other entrepreneurs face. And, you know, based on your experience and this working with companies through Techstars and all of the other ventures that you’ve done, what would you say are some of the key challenges that you’ve seen companies when it comes to identifying these metrics or tracking the right things?

[00:14:53] Like what are some of the challenges that, that you’ve seen. 

[00:14:57] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:14:57] You, you know, there’s a few and I would say [00:15:00] that probably, you know, and, and, and I bet you, Trevor and I have slightly different answers here. So, so, so Trevor definitely chime in too, but I think the most common one is sort of the simplest one, but it goes, it, it parlays off of what Trevor just said, which is, or will you just say, which is there’s so much data out there.

[00:15:19] And especially as an early stage founder, you know, if you’re raising money or even if you’re not raising money, but you’re, you know, you have, uh, you know, advisors, whatever you’re trying to show that you’ve done something. And so what happens is companies become really metrics aware of the things that they’ve done that are lagging and anchor on those.

[00:15:41] And so they’re trying to drive towards an anchor that looks at the past versus what Trevor was saying, which is I’m doing things that are unlocking something for the future. And that’s a difference between being metrics, aware, looking at something that tells you what happened versus being metrics driven, which is doing something that is [00:16:00] creative.

[00:16:01] The next thing that is going to happen. Um, and so like another way to think about that is when you think about even looking at your financial model, which you know, is assuming that companies have even a basic one, the difference between, you know, you telling the model what to do and the model telling you what to do, right.

[00:16:16] You’re trying to get to the point where the model is telling you what. But you have to do those things to get there. And, and so that learning process and being comfortable with making tons and tons of mistakes as you learn that that to me is the biggest challenge I think, would becoming metrics driven versus metrics, aware the fear of like, if I make a mistake, I’m going to be viewed a certain way, or I’m not going to be successful when actually the mistakes are what make you successful?

[00:16:41] The learning from the mistakes make a success. 

[00:16:44] William Glass: [00:16:44] Yeah, Amos. That’s a great way to, to frame that, um, in terms of, you know, focusing on the, the forward looking things, allowing the model to actually help you drive and make the decisions in the business. So how do you think about financial [00:17:00] models then? Right.

[00:17:00] Cause I, I mean, one of the. One of the things that you hear in the fundraising world and startup world is that, ah, we all know it’s wrong. The model that you’re creating at least early on, it’s just, you know, what are the assumptions and thinking through, but we know that every number on there is going to be wrong.

[00:17:15] So how do you go from that sort of mentality into a model that drives your business? 

[00:17:23] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:17:23] Can you mind if I start this one off? Cause I love you too. Yeah. Cool. So I, I think, I think that there’s this notion where people, you know, like, like people have said, oh, we know your is wrong. We just want to see it.

[00:17:35] Right. And somehow that is manifested into this very flippant, like, oh, who cares? It’s just a model. But the reality is w w w w w what we’re really saying is that it’s not the numbers that we’re focused on, but it’s trying to understand what are the mechanics of the business. And like, so if I’m an investor looking at your model as an entrepreneur, I want to see how your thinking about the business, because you’re the one who’s doing the [00:18:00] complex brain work.

[00:18:01] And so if you’re asking me to go do it. For you, like, I might as well just go do the business. So I want to see how you’re thinking the mechanics might work so that we can have an academic discussion about the things I believe, you know, as an investor believe, and don’t believe more importantly, you as the entrepreneur, what are you going to go to do to prove whether or not the thing you, how you think it’s going to work will actually work.

[00:18:21] The numbers will flush themselves out over years, not, not months, years. So like, how do we know that we’re going to be heading in the right door? 

[00:18:30] Trevor Boehm: [00:18:30] Yup is that I think that’s great. And I’ll add two pieces to, uh, uh, Troy who wrote the shorthand ACOs, who wrote the financial model chapter chapter in the book talks about the power of your, an assumptions driven model in anchoring the conversation.

[00:18:48] Very similar to what Amos just said, um, towards the specifics of where you either agree or disagree. Right? Well, in, in, in the logic or in the thinking, so it’s easy to be [00:19:00] able to present. So what does that mean? So in other words, it’s easy to be able to present some hockey, stick growth, spread of like, okay, here’s how things are gonna look.

[00:19:06] Here’s what our performance looks like over time. Uh, but if you have an assumptions driven model, meaning if all of those, all of those numbers are actually. Um, resulting from some very specific, uh, assumptions around who your customer is, how you’re getting them on the cost for getting them what the acquisition channels are going to be, which all, all of that.

[00:19:25] Um, then you can actually go back to the model when you’re having a conversation with an investor or whomever and say, okay, well, this is, this is the assumption I made, right. That actually drives that growth. Tell me where I’m off. Like tell me where you actually disagree. On a given assumption and then you have a much more robust conversation, right?

[00:19:41] Because then they’re talking about, well, actually I don’t think your customer acquisition costs is going to be like that, or they’re saying like, I’m not really sure that you’re going to be able to maintain, uh, that level of, you know, ratio of like sales person to convert it, you know, whatever it is. And, um, and then you can back that up.

[00:19:58] Here’s my data. Here’s the, here’s [00:20:00] the, here’s the thing I went and tried. Right. And the experiment that I ran that allowed me to conclude that this would be the assumption that I put in. So. That’s on the. That’s on the fundraising side, but that we actually don’t take financial models are primarily a fundraising tool at all.

[00:20:15] Right. Well, they’re, they’re actually an operating tool, right? How does this allow you to see into the future so that you can make decisions for your business? And a key part of that in the beauty of the financial model is it’s, it’s, it’s gives you the, the ability to play what. Right to run scenarios on what might happen within the business so that you can make a more informed plan.

[00:20:38] So you’re able to say, okay, if I charged him, I increased my price by 50%, right. What would happen if I increased my advertising spend by 25%, you know, what would happen there? And you can suddenly see its effect played out over time. And of course it’s riddled with assumptions that, that you’ll get better and better at identifying over a time.

[00:20:56] So at first it is all wrong, but, uh, but eventually it’ll get more [00:21:00] and more, right. And, uh, and, and, and so that’s scenario planning that allows you to say, okay, here’s where we really need to go, uh, based on the data that I have and then go act on it. 

[00:21:12] William Glass: [00:21:12] Oh yeah. I appreciate you guys breaking that down. Cause I think that makes a lot of sense in terms of how to really utilize a model, to make decisions, start with the assumptions and then start testing and actually putting in real-world numbers that you get that allow you to then play out the scenarios.

[00:21:26] How effective is that? Have you seen that? Do you have any examples of companies that have done this successfully or, you know, just how, how do you actually do this the right way? 

[00:21:39] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:21:39] Yeah, lots of examples of, I mean, I would argue every successful company or almost every successful company has, uh, has done this well.

[00:21:49] Um, uh, I, I’m not sure that I know how, like some businesses can stumble into decent. Early success without it, but in order to get to true [00:22:00] repeatability and scale and, and, you know, be something that’s, uh, you know, providing value. I don’t, I don’t know that you can, you don’t have to use our process, but I don’t know that you can actually do it without being, you know, truly metrics driven and have a financial model that is predicting, you know, trying to predict the future.

[00:22:15] Right. That’s what public companies do all the time. Right. They’re using their model to say, here’s what we think our earnings will be every quarter. And when they’re not. They know very specifically why? Because they have such a good handle on their I’ll 

[00:22:27] Trevor Boehm: [00:22:27] give, I’ll give three examples that, uh, quickly that are different, very different companies and at different stages.

[00:22:35] But, um, each I think demonstrate the power of the model in their own way. So one would be a company called creation, create these are all companies that, um, we’ve invested in as well. So creation create is a. Um, it’s a subscription box, uh, for stem education. So, you know, help you or, or your child, uh, learn how to unpack like different build a robot or, or sort of other [00:23:00] kinds of cool projects.

[00:23:01] And they have, um, they’re so dialed in, in their model, meaning like they, they so deeply understand how the mechanics of the business work that, um, they’re able to predict. Really regularly what the next quarter is going to be, um, with like some pretty remarkable consistency. And, and so the, the power of that is then they can like go back and back on.

[00:23:25] Um, they’re able to sort of have confidence in what they do. Um, what they’re investing in, right? So they’re, they’re actually having to buy inventory at times. They’re having to make big bets on what the holiday season is going to look like. Right? Because the holiday season is a key part of, um, a lot of the sales, right.

[00:23:41] And they have that confidence because they have confidence in their model, which is backed by data. The second is, um, a company called, um, skipper or skip town. Skip town is a, is a. Retail sort of, uh, experience for dog [00:24:00] owners or I should say for dogs, what do they say for, for, um, for pets and there, uh, do you have a term for parents or something and their parents?

[00:24:09] Yeah. Yeah. It’s, it’s, it’s like not pet owners, right? Sick. The tech is the primary and then the, you know, the person who’s just along for the ride and, um, And they, they had a huge shift, right? So they used to be this, uh, marketplace model for, for, for pet walking right services. And, uh, they shifted towards this retail experience.

[00:24:27] Uh in-person bar food, dog park, cleaning, all kinds of stuff. Right. Huge, big bet into this, into this retail space. Uh, but they had a deep understanding of their customer and it. It’s really robust model based again, based on data, not just sort of made up in the middle of, you know, the air and they were able to say, okay, how many down to the level of like how many drinks is somebody’s going to have every time that they come in?

[00:24:52] Like, how frequently is somebody going to come in? And how long are they going to stay? How much food will they buy? Right. What’s the margin on each of those items. [00:25:00] And, and that visibility allowed them to say one. To launch, which they launched in the middle of the pandemic, which is a huge feat in and of itself.

[00:25:09] And, uh, and, and it they’d be actually beat all those numbers, right. They should did better than what they assumed they would be. Last one, uh, is a company called home buyer and there are, they’re pretty early stage. Um, there are a mortgage lender, uh, that, uh, that, that offers a really great. Fast mortgages to first time home buyers.

[00:25:29] And, um, and, and th the, the stage perspective matters because they’re at this part right now where they’re focused on sort of really nailing the top part of their funnel. Like, if we can really understand how it is, we get customers, then everything else will trickle through. And, and then, and so he’s been very focused narrowly on sort of the heart of this part of the model.

[00:25:49] Um, when most people would be focused down stream, right? Saying like, okay, well, how many actually, how many, how many mortgages are we actually doing? Right. Which is an interesting number, but it’s a lagging number and it actually doesn’t help you [00:26:00] that much. And so by having that full model, he’ll have active conversations that we’ll be talking all the time, they’ll say, Hey, what?

[00:26:06] Um, Uh, you were seeing this number play out. And like in my model says that if we can hit these numbers, then we’re going to be a really good shape over here. And so it gives him conviction and confidence to be able to focus on something that might, you might feel. Nervous about red. You might sort of say, ah, no, I need to go focus over here.

[00:26:28] Right. Because, um, it’s not, it’s not resulting in these direct sort of impact on revenue. Um, but because he has an understanding of how that will trickle down, eventually he’s able to sort of stay the course right. And optimize the part of the business that he thinks is most critical. Right. 

[00:26:43] William Glass: [00:26:43] Awesome. Yeah.

[00:26:44] Thanks for sharing those Trevor. It makes, yeah, it makes a lot of sense. And I appreciate you highlighting how to do this successfully. Um, cause it sounds like this is almost a priority. It’s a prioritization tool as well. Right? Where do I spend my time? Based on the model, the assumptions that I’ve made, the things that are [00:27:00] actually driving the business forward.

[00:27:01] I’m not worried about the thousand things that I, that are, you know, asking for my attention as an entrepreneur, but I can focus on the one, two key things that are actually going to drive the business. 

[00:27:12] Trevor Boehm: [00:27:12] Yep. Yeah, that’s right. I am. And you must have been talking to you my ticket. Go ahead. If you have a comment or 

[00:27:19] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:27:19] I w I was just agreeing.

[00:27:20] I mean, I think, you know, we, we believe that too, and we’ve sort of built that into the process itself, which is, you know, maybe another, you know, there’s probably several like, common things that Trevor and I, if you put us in separate rooms, ask us what, what are the biggest mistakes entrepreneurs make?

[00:27:36] Like, we’ll probably tell you mostly the same. And one of them is. Um, is working on all the wrong things. And so I think, I think you’re right, which is why we’ve built a piece of that into the, into the framework. 

[00:27:49] William Glass: [00:27:49] Yeah, no, I love that. And I’ve definitely, I feel like probably every entrepreneur is guilty of focusing on the wrong things that at some point in time, and, you know, hopefully you figure that out sooner rather than [00:28:00] later.

[00:28:00] Um, one of the things that you’ve talked about, um, is one you use the term repeatability, which is, I noticed it’s different than saying scale. Um, which I think is interesting that you didn’t note that. Um, but there’s also this notion of that the unit economics have to make sense in the longterm. And if, even if they don’t in the short term, could you speak to that in terms of, of, of why that’s so important?

[00:28:25] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:28:25] Yeah, well, I will. And I’ll touch on the repeatability versus scale first, which is the thing that, the thing that I think people miss is that, um, repeatability unlocks the ability to scale and a big, another big mistake that entrepreneurs make is they’ll, you know, they’ll do a couple of things. They’ll say, great.

[00:28:41] If we want to scale, right, I’ve made three sales. I want to scale our sales team, but you don’t actually know how to do that. So you go and hire a bunch of people, but no one knows what to do, right. Or whatever it might be within products. So repeatability unlocks scale. Um, so, uh, to, to, to answer your other question, [00:29:00] um, which just escaped me, cause I, again, I haven’t had enough cost of care.

[00:29:03] Well, they’re important because you know, at the end of the day, if your unit economics said the simplest way, if your new unit economics don’t work, your business goes away because you literally don’t have money to run it. Right. And, and, and there are, you know, you know, cases and, you know, I guess, you know, you can probably use, um, you know, Uber as an example of this, or, you know, some of the other, you know, uh, what was the daily deal site from, uh, from several years back that never actually had positive unit economics, that company doesn’t exist in the same form anymore.

[00:29:36] They were able to raise a lot of money on the hope that they would get to go to unit economics at some point in the future. But the thing that understanding that you can get to positive unit economics, Allows you to do is it allows you to take more risks. It allows you to go and unlock the, you know, different parts of the business.

[00:29:55] You might not have been otherwise able to do because you always know. Well, if I do [00:30:00] these, if I just scale back or maybe scale back, because even the wrong say, if I, if I bring it to these things, I can run a business for as long as I need to. I may be not grow as fast as I want, but I understand. And I also understand what the, where are the points where I can put the pedal down so that I can start to scale what is repeatable.

[00:30:19] William Glass: [00:30:19] Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense, Amos. So in, in terms of this book, it’s not just for companies that. Want to go raise venture capital it’s for companies that are trying to become profitable and maybe never take on capital. Is that, is that correct? Cause that’s what I’m hearing through the, the repeatability and the scalability.

[00:30:38] It’s not necessarily you’re advocating one, one route or the other. 

[00:30:42] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:30:42] That’s right. We’re not advocating for a path what our goal in this. But our biggest goal in this book is to say, you want to build a business. It’s really hard. There’s going to be lots of things flying from all over the place. This book will give you the discipline, the disciplines you need in order to [00:31:00] figure out how to achieve the vision that you have for the thing you want to go do, regardless of the path that you want to take.

[00:31:06] So we’re not biased one way or the other against raising capital or. You can be a real estate agent. And in fact, we’ve, we’ve worked with a real estate agent who is looking to go from, you know, a sole agent to a multi-agent, um, uh, office and used our process to figure out how to do that. 

[00:31:26] William Glass: [00:31:26] That’s awesome.

[00:31:27] Yeah, no, I love that. Cause I think that, you know, obviously being, being in venture world that tends to be what gets the headlines. When a company raises a ton of money and you don’t hear about the company that has slowly built up. Up to tens or 20 hundreds of millions of dollars. And they’re in some, some industry that is waste management or something like that, right.

[00:31:48] That no one’s going to be, be talking about. Cause it’s not sexy. Um, so I love that you’re that you’re supporting the entrepreneurs. Um, but I’d love to get your take on the, you know, the, the venture side of it as [00:32:00] well. When you think about how tech stars fits in the ecosystem, um, how regular venture funds, I think, um, you know, one of you guys was also with, uh, like the Alexa team for a while, right.

[00:32:10] And that fund and corporate VC. So like, there’s just so much out there. How do you decide as an entrepreneur. Which route would be best for your business and navigating the various accelerators venture funds, corporate venture that are out there. 

[00:32:27] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:32:27] I think to some degree it’s largely a personal decision early on, meaning like.

[00:32:36] You know, if, if I’m going to go build me Amos, you know, and Trevor we’re, you know, I’m going to speak for Trevor here. Cause I I’m pretty positive that we’re in the same boat here. If we were going to go build a business tomorrow, we would put off raising outside capital as long as possible. Um, because for many reasons, but one is, you know, because we want to have, have enough understanding and control of what [00:33:00] the business actually does before we take on the responsibility of someone’s capital.

[00:33:04] And when we take on that capital, we want to use it to scale because we understand repeatability not to, not to, you know, give us, um, a leash to learn and see if there’s even anything here, which. Yeah, there’s a world where that exists and I’m not saying it’s more or less responsible, but it’s a, it’s a different kind of responsibility you’re taking on, um, in a different kind of capital you’re taking on.

[00:33:27] So I think there are some businesses that don’t require raising capital. You know, maybe you can get there faster, but they don’t require, and there are other businesses, like if you’re in biotech, it’s probably pretty hard to build something. If you’re not raising outside 

[00:33:39] Trevor Boehm: [00:33:39] capital. You know, Thomas’s last point right there.

[00:33:44] Um, different kinds of opportunities require different kinds of fuel, right. Are different levels of fuel. And, um, and also different entrepreneurs have different like, um, risk tolerance is capacity, right. And, and resources to go execute on the [00:34:00] world that they. They want to, they want to build. So there are a lot of, I think at the earliest stages, particularly, um, it detects the beauty of the world we’re in now is that there are so many resources that can, um, help entrepreneurs at the early stages.

[00:34:16] Um, get, get moving and that’s the beauty of an accelerator, right? That’s what programs like Techstars do really well. Um, and I think, um, people, the thing I would say around venture capital or sort of funding. Generally is that, uh, so we’re going to say one thing would be that most people don’t really understand, uh, the sort of implications sort of the third, the fourth, the fifth step down the, what you have down the path of the choices that they might be making, or that they would be encouraged, right.

[00:34:49] To make, um, relative to, you know, to the business they’re trying to build. So. Well, what do I mean by that? I mean that, um, most like big VC [00:35:00] is expect huge returns and not every opportunity or not every business, uh, can, can command that kind of return. And so for the entrepreneur, having a really clear idea of like, what kind of business do I want to build?

[00:35:13] What kind of, how much competence do I have in that, that business is going to, it’s going to be of that size and how. How do I, if I don’t have that level of conviction, how do I stage my commitments in a way that maintains the optionality, which is, which is what, some of what Anissa’s was talking about.

[00:35:28] We’re saying like, how do I move forward in a way that says, even if I’m a $20 million business, right. Instead of a hundred or a billion or $10 billion business, right? Like I still have a great outcome that it’s still really good for me. It’s still really good for the people who are part of it, you know?

[00:35:43] Uh, and, uh, And I can, you know, right off to the sunset. And then it, rather than saying, like, I’ve now narrowed the possibilities of success for myself in a way that I really only have one do it outcome and it’s 0.005%. The chance. [00:36:00] Which for some people is great. Right. They’re sort of going for it. But, um, but I, I like to find ways in which to use the Amazon language, talking about Alexa in a second ago, Amazon has this concept of two-way doors, basically like structure as many things as you can so that if you go through the door and you don’t like it, you can walk right back out the door and everything’s still okay.

[00:36:21] Hmm. 

[00:36:22] William Glass: [00:36:22] That makes a lot of sense. And I like that concept and yeah. Why Amos, I think you used the word responsibility when raising capital and Trevor, you, you hit on this too, of, of once you, once you take on investor capital, you now have a responsibility to that, that party, right? So there’s the, the way that you make decisions changes as well as the implications for the decisions that you make as an entrepreneur in terms of.

[00:36:47] If, if you, if, if someone’s reading this book levers and they take away one thing or, you know, one major concept, what is the, the, the thing that you hope they take away, or the action that you hope someone takes after [00:37:00] reading 

[00:37:00] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:37:00] the book? I think the, the thing that I would want anyone to take away is that regardless of whether they subscribe to the leverage process or not.

[00:37:12] That they understand the importance of becoming metrics driven versus metrics, aware to set them up for the best possible success. Yeah. 

[00:37:23] William Glass: [00:37:23] That’s great. And then I’m curious to get a little bit more personal on each of, of how you guys define this yourself. Um, have obviously, you know, wrote a book that, which is incredible, um, a big feat in of itself worked in venture and startups and all these different things at this point in your life.

[00:37:41] How, how do you define success? Like what does success look like to you? Personal professional, whatever successes to 

[00:37:49] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:37:49] you. Yeah. I, for me, for me, I think about this a lot actually, and I have a lot in the last couple of years, it’s too, for me, it’s two things. One, am I [00:38:00] making an impact, a noticeable and ideally quantifiable impact on the people around me.

[00:38:06] Me that, um, you know, that I’m working with. And I think, you know, just to that point, like the answer to your last question, um, we don’t care if you don’t use our process, we want you to be impacted by the notion of it more importantly. And if you, and if you subscribe to it and you share it with others, because you think it’s great, that’s an extra bonus, but you know, the out the, the hope is we’re making an impact on people.

[00:38:29] So, so one is the impact and. And the other thing for me personally, when I’m, when I’m trying to achieve something, is, do I have a clear understanding of what the goal that I’m trying to achieve is do I hit it and if I don’t hit it, do I understand why? And it’s okay if I don’t hit it, but if I understand why I look at that as successful.

[00:38:52] William Glass: [00:38:52] I like that a lot understanding, understanding why. Right. Cause I think pretty much everyone has had a goal and [00:39:00] either not stuck to it or missed it or whatever it is and whatever aspect of your life. So I really liked that, that focus on at least understanding why, if I don’t achieve something, 

[00:39:10] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:39:10] what about UT.

[00:39:12] Trevor Boehm: [00:39:12] Yeah. So there’s a, I’ll give to you. It’s just a question. The first is sort of, um, more, uh, almost superficial, which is just, I like building things. Like I like seeing things that don’t exist in the world start to exist. Right. So that’s, that’s fun to me. And, uh, and I just enjoy it and I probably am too. Uh, Uh, uh, I’m, I’m, I’m pretty fun driven, meaning like, I just liked doing things that I like doing.

[00:39:40] I don’t like doing it. I’m like, I don’t know how much I want to do that. Not that not that hard work, isn’t a component of that. Right. But I’m sort of compelled to something that just sounds really good to me and exciting to me. And I’m willing to sort of put in the, um, the, the discipline right ticket. So that’s one answer.

[00:39:55] The second is really, I find myself to be not dissimilar to what Amos just said, very [00:40:00] people driven. And there’s an old story that I’m still in from a book whose name I can’t remember right now. It talks about these two politicians in, in England. And, uh, and they sort of contrast the two people and gonna say, you know, about this one politician and he would talk to.

[00:40:16] And after you talked to him, you left that dinner party, right? Thinking, man, that is the most interesting, uh, most fascinating, intelligent person I’ve ever met. And then there’s this other politician that you have conversations with. And then after you leave that, you know, same dinner party, and you’re talking about, um, the conversation you, how do you say man, that person made me feel like the most interesting, the most intelligent, the most fascinating person I’ve ever met.

[00:40:43] And to me, it’s that second. Uh, person that I, that I aspire to, to be, and the language that they put it again, I’m still on from this book, but it’s the idea of how do you identify the treasure? And someone else and then put it to good use. So, so for me, if my [00:41:00] life could be about, about anything, it would, it would be about that.

[00:41:03] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:41:03] Yeah. That’s awesome. I haven’t heard that story. That’s a good one. Yeah. 

[00:41:08] Trevor Boehm: [00:41:08] Yeah. 

[00:41:08] William Glass: [00:41:08] That is. Do you, have you, have you, uh, found any success or certain things that you’ve done, that, that, uh, how you’ve been able to unlock treasure that treasure and other people, anything that tactics, things that you’ve done? 

[00:41:21] Trevor Boehm: [00:41:21] Yeah.

[00:41:22] Yeah. Hi, if you just get genuinely interested in what other people are doing and kind of what they care about, and you learn how to ask questions, that help to draw that out in a way that, um, helps you, where do you see them light up? Right. And get excited and hopefully get clear, get a better sense of clarity into their own thinking.

[00:41:44] I think, um, like even sort of there’s like your own internal dialogue. Great. How do you have more, better, better converse, helping others have better conversations with themselves that, uh, I think that goes a long way in that 

[00:41:56] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:41:56] I think. And I’ll just chime in that. Trevor is [00:42:00] exceptional at doing that at making people feel, everybody feels special.

[00:42:05] Um, and what do you think is exceptional about the way that he does that is he does it in a really subtle way. It happens and no one realized it’s happened until afterwards. 

[00:42:15] William Glass: [00:42:15] That’s awesome. That’s awesome. I love that. So one of the, kind of to wrap up the show, um, my focus is on personal finance and I’d love to ask you guys a couple of questions around that, especially coming from an investor space.

[00:42:32] I think you guys have some interesting, uh, interesting thoughts around it. Um, but how would you describe your relationship with money?

[00:42:43] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:42:43] Uh, man, I have, I grew up pretty poor and I grew up with, um, you know, I had just had this conversation with my father a couple of weeks ago where he was out of the blue apologize for me for not giving me more education around personal [00:43:00] finance. Um, I have a, I have a fear like, like for me, money is like, uh, um, that not having.

[00:43:08] Is is scary. And I would say it is, uh, is probably in some ways made me a better investor and in some ways have, maybe even held me back. So probably had if had both things, but, um, uh, I’m, I’m grappling with that now as I try to loosen up my fear and understand it more deeply. 

[00:43:29] William Glass: [00:43:29] That’s interesting. And I, you’re not alone there when it comes to fear.

[00:43:31] I think that’s one of the most common, common responses. Unfortunately, fear and shame. Get that a lot as well. 

[00:43:40] Trevor Boehm: [00:43:40] Trevor, what about you? Yeah, this is a fun question. So I, uh, I have probably a couple of sort of perspectives on, on personal finance. I think growing up, I had. I like a lot of interest in, uh, in money and, and [00:44:00] almost like in the game sense of the way.

[00:44:01] Um, so I would, my, my dad introduced me to the stock market, like really early on. Um, and I had saved up some money, you know, from, from working, uh, Odd jobs. Right. Okay. Since I was like seven, I’d been pulling weeds and mowing lawns way too early. Right. I was like behind a lawn mower and like age, literally age seven.

[00:44:20] I can’t imagine as it is as a parent of a 40 year old, I can’t imagine my child mowing lawns for somebody else in three years. But, uh, but anyway, I had, I had a little bit of money to put it in the stock market and, um, I’m going to sort of revealing my age here, but I thought, okay, what do I put my money into?

[00:44:36] I’ll do it. The, the two things I like best. Uh, and Pixar because, you know, toy story is a great movie and a Netscape was a pretty cool internet browser that I used. So, um, so is there any, all that to say, like there’s one part of me that sort of just had a lot of fun with it, the idea of like, sort of building wealth and then I took the other part would be, um, uh, [00:45:00] back to the like less that if you, if there are two dynamics, right.

[00:45:02] Sort of fear and shame would be more on the shame side. Right. I feel like this is a lot of fun and like, you know, when it. The consistency of building the discipline right. In my own world and life that’s did the work right. For me. If how do I make sure I’m establishing the disciplines that really matter, right?

[00:45:20] Uh, for, for long term financial health and security. And, uh, and how do I like to make sure I, I keep that sort of, uh, Open attitude right. In my own. Like, it’s easier when you’re, to me, for anyone I’ll speak for myself. Right. It’s easier when I’m sort of thinking about it in abstract or even within the work context, or it’s really thinking about the decision-making when I’m making an investment, it has a different layer of psychology to it.

[00:45:46] Then, uh, then when you’re talking about sort of your own, your own world, um, some people probably feel differently and it’s probably for good reason. Like I wish I probably had, you know, it was more consistent. Yeah, that’s my story. [00:46:00] Yeah, no, 

[00:46:00] William Glass: [00:46:00] I appreciate you sharing. And that’s lucky that you had a, that you had a dad that introduced you at least to the stock market at a young age, because even if you made some good decisions, I’m assuming Pixar probably did pretty well.

[00:46:10] Netscape. 

[00:46:12] Trevor Boehm: [00:46:12] Who knows? Well, they, they both did great actually. Um, you know, it wasn’t very much money. It wasn’t very much money, but, uh, but you know, relatively speaking, they had some pretty good stuff. 

[00:46:22] William Glass: [00:46:22] There you go. Yeah. And that guy that piqued the interest. So what would you say is the best investment that you’ve made?

[00:46:30] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:46:30] In myself. Is that fair? Is that a fair answer? 

[00:46:33] William Glass: [00:46:33] Your answer? It’s your answer. There’s no wrong answer. Right? So whatever’s, whatever’s true to you. So yeah. 

[00:46:38] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:46:38] Yeah, I think, uh, I, I remember hearing it from somebody early on. I don’t even remember who, but I just read another article the other day about it. Right.

[00:46:50] It’s like the most common thing to say, but I think most people don’t do, but I think investing in myself to be able to get the most out of life. 

[00:47:00] [00:47:00] William Glass: [00:47:00] Okay. 

[00:47:01] Trevor Boehm: [00:47:01] So what do you mean dig in there a little bit? Yeah. 

[00:47:07] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:47:07] Um, meaning, uh, I th you know, w like your question I think is around finances, and I think I’m just extra abstracting it out further, which is, you know, we’re on the, you know, we’re on this planet for some amount of time.

[00:47:21] And I think, you know, I’ve, I’m trying really hard to make the most out of that time. And, and, um, so the, you know, whether it’s, um, things to do to keep my brain healthy or my body healthy, um, Okay. Whether it’s things so I can get more experiences or I can bring more impact to the people that I’m working with, but making sure that it’s not that there are things in every day of my life that are helping me feel healthy so that I can be better at all the other things that I do.

[00:47:54] William Glass: [00:47:54] That makes sense. Yeah. It kind of goes back to wanting to make sure that you’re healthy so that you can have that impact on the people that are closest to you. Going [00:48:00] back to how you’re defining sex. 

[00:48:02] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:48:02] Yeah, but if you’re asking financial investment, it was investing in home Depot several years back.

[00:48:08] Perfect.

[00:48:12] Trevor Boehm: [00:48:12] Treasure. What about you? This is a fun. Yeah, this is a fun question. I, uh, and I liked the way Amos took his answer because you think about. What is the most, uh, valuable asset that we have. Um, the one reasonable answer would be your sort of physical body, right. Or, or sort of yourself. Right. And so by taking care of that, you can ensure that it, it sticks around.

[00:48:34] Right. And you get value from it into the long haul. So, um, and there’s probably sort of emotional, relational, you know, mental components to that as well. I like that. Um, I also think about the question relative to like outcomes versus process, right? So the best in. You make, like, does that mean best investment decision or does that mean best like best outcome?

[00:49:00] [00:48:59] And those things are not the same. Like I, uh, you know, early I’ll give them, I’ll give you the answer is sort of, I think my first, my first best investment. Right. Which was, uh, which is actually the home that my wife and I bought together. Right. And, and like, I was not, um, Uh, that was not a good decision process on my part because I didn’t want to do it.

[00:49:20] I was like, ah, it was just dumb. I like, I feel like I’m going to be tied to Austin and I don’t want, I want to get out of here. I, I don’t want to put a bunch of money into this house. I didn’t get to take care of. And my wife was like, well, I don’t want to be bouncing around, you know, from, from, uh, you know, to apartment apartment every year.

[00:49:34] So we’re going to buy a house and, uh, and it was a great, it was a great outcome. Very great decision because. It one, it, it, it, you know, it, it kept us in a city that we now deeply care about. Um, and, and have, you know, strong relationships with, uh, you know, the Austin real estate market is obviously been boom bang.

[00:49:54] Right. So, um, it set us on a good path right into the future, uh, that, that allowed us to [00:50:00] do a bunch of other things, you know? And so, uh, but, but yeah, the process, the decision making actually itself, I don’t know how thoughtful I was, you know, in that process. 

[00:50:10] William Glass: [00:50:10] Yeah, no, I’m glad that you brought that up because I think that’s a distinction between the actual decision-making process and not, you hear like, uh, I’ve heard poker players think about this, right?

[00:50:20] You may lose a hand, but if you played the odds, right, and you just got unlucky, you just got unlucky versus you make a really reckless decision and you happen to win. You’re going to actually incentivize the wrong behaviors. Long-term, that’s kind of how I, you know, how I’m interpreting your response to them.

[00:50:36] Mm. 

[00:50:37] Trevor Boehm: [00:50:37] And I think that’s a lot of the venture world, right. Especially in the, in the early stage world, like what hits is, is like sometimes more, um, can be more sort of random than, than not. Right. And so you, you as an investor, right? It’s easy to get sort of, um, put too much. Uh, energy or focus on, uh, what you perceive to be [00:51:00] doing the best.

[00:51:00] And usually that means the amount of money they’ve raised most recently, which is not, it does not an indicator of longterm success. Right. Um, and, uh, and so it’s, it’s critical. I think that that attitude, I think hopefully will sort of in the longterm. Uh, make towards better sort of financial investing, venture investing, right.

[00:51:22] By saying like, okay, how do I, how do I resist sort of leaning towards whatever, perceived, whatever I perceive to be the best outcome at the current moment. Yeah. 

[00:51:31] William Glass: [00:51:31] Love that. And so we’ve talked about the good stuff. What about the other side? What’s the dumbest money mistake that you’ve made?

[00:51:44] Trevor Boehm: [00:51:44] I’m glad that you’re going first. 

[00:51:46] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:51:46] Yeah. I missed money mistake. I’ve made a lot of dumb money mistakes, one that one that actually haunts me on a regular basis. And I don’t have a ton of things that I’m actually regretful for in my life. But, uh, I [00:52:00] lived in LA for nine years and we had a great apartment in Santa Monica.

[00:52:06] And we sold it. It was so stupid. Like it’s probably tripled in value. Plus we don’t have a place in Santa Monica anymore and it was no relative, even at the time, it wasn’t expensive to have kept it and we could have rented it. And it just was, you know, growing up without any financial education, I thought having the cash in hand was more valuable than the asset itself.

[00:52:30] There was a lot of learning there. Yeah. That’s 

[00:52:33] William Glass: [00:52:33] a good one. 

[00:52:35] Trevor Boehm: [00:52:35] I don’t know if I have a great answer. I’m trying to think through like, what would be a really, like, I’m sure I’m missing some like massive, you know, bad decision that I’ve made of like a large magnitude, but I’m only thinking of like small magnitude decisions.

[00:52:50] Um, and I, and I kind of cop out answer I’m thinking is, uh, is, is I have not like early on, I, I wish I had been more [00:53:00] consistent about just to like, get rich slowly. Uh, sort of dynamics around just the small amounts of money invested and uh, in, in, in, um, Assets that are, you know, creating compound interest.

[00:53:15] Right. And that like has such a good compound effect. And I even knew that sort of in my head, in my early twenties, right. Sort of knew that, that the power of those dynamics, but I didn’t always play them out. So I’d say that that’s a kind of a simple answer or not that interesting of an answer, but, but isn’t one, um, I made some bad decisions in the startups that are.

[00:53:35] Um, I made some bad decisions in starting the company. So I started, so I think like those would be another like, like really not really seeing the risk tolerance I had before I jumped into a SIG would be, uh, probably be the only. Like that. 

[00:53:52] William Glass: [00:53:52] Yeah. Awesome. Well, guys, this has been a lot of fun. I really appreciate you guys sitting down and sharing a bit about the book and, [00:54:00] um, how people can think about entrepreneurship and then, you know, getting a little vulnerable here at the end, talking about, uh, some of the good things and not so good things in terms of finance, but I want to leave you guys with the last word.

[00:54:10] So if there’s anything you want to share, and then also please let the audience know the best way to connect with you outside of the podcast and where they can get the book. 

[00:54:17] Amos Schwartzfarb: [00:54:17] Yeah that well, firstly, thank you for having us on. I really appreciate it. And it was fun to chat with you. Uh, I think for me, um, you know, I’ll just probably restate something I said before the, the, the thought for any, you know, entrepreneurs and founders out there is.

[00:54:33] Um, figure out how to be, not just metrics aware, but metrics, metrics driven, you know, you can use our process or not, but it’s going to be critical to your long-term success. Um, and you know, the probably the best way to get in touch with us right now is just to go to levers book.com. Obviously you get the book there too.

[00:54:52] You can learn more about, um, the, the, when we teach the process without when we work with PR entrepreneurs, hand in hand on the [00:55:00] process, you can learn about it there and you can reach out. Uh, through leversbook.com or on Twitter and LinkedIn, of course. 

[00:55:06] William Glass: [00:55:06] Awesome. Thank you guys. Appreciate you guys sitting down and, uh, have a great rest of your day.

[00:55:10] Cool. Thank you so 

[00:55:11] Trevor Boehm: [00:55:11] much. On your way out, please 

[00:55:14] William Glass: [00:55:14] share the podcast with others. It’s the only way that the community grows and others hear these incredible stories from entrepreneurs and top performers. And of course, pound that subscribe. And so you notified them and upstairs to drop every Friday. I’m William Glass, CEO and co-founder of ostrich.

[00:55:28] And of course you are the host of the Silicon alley podcast have a very profitable. You got 

[00:55:34] Trevor Boehm: [00:55:34] on top two ways, but still you, as it say, caught in a circle say, and I’ll never leave this place

[00:55:47] so much, go to such a vulnerable right side over and over.

End of Transcription

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Tagged : Entrepreneurship / Startup